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900 bpm questions Posted: 2014-10-12 02:55  (Last Edited: 2014-10-12 08:54) Reply | Quote
OneHitLeft

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#62697
Hey guys. I've been using Famitracker and lurking the forums for a few months now, but haven't made anything I felt would be worth sharing yet. Lots of cool little riffs, and short patterns that I like, but I'm still working on incorporating enough dynamics to have a completed song.

The reason for the post is because I've seen some people that write songs that are 900 bpm. I'm curious how this is possible with the tracking software, because it moves so fast once it starts playing.

So I guess my main questions are these:

1. Pros and cons of writing at 900 bpm?

2. How do you actually do it? (write at slower tempos, but place the notes where they will be played when it speeds up?)

3. Is there any major difference in sound quality, or how instruments are created when working at 900 bpm?

[color=green][i]Thread moved to the appropriate forum section. ~Mod[/i]

Posted: 2014-10-12 03:28  (Last Edited: 2014-10-12 03:35) Reply | Quote
Warheart

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#62698
Pros:
No instrument limit (since you don't actually need to create instruments)

if you're using arpeggio macros and still want to do pitch slides at the same, it might be a good idea to use Pxx effects in 900 bpm

Cons:
You have to copy-paste literally everything and every time you are using complex instruments

You have to figure out the note placement, otherwise your song will have the wrong tempo

You might run out of rows if you care about reusing patterns

Generally takes longer time to do anything in 900 bpm


Unless your song is actually in 900 bpm, want to save space for instruments or want to do cool things with VRC7, there's no reason to use this.

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Posted: 2014-10-12 04:18  (Last Edited: 2014-10-12 04:20) Reply | Quote
VinylScratch

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#62702
2. For tempo: Set your 1st row highlight to whatever speed you're trying to achieve (keep the actual speed at 1, though). Set the 2nd highlight to 4x that. In this case, the 1st highlight will act as 16th note placements and the 2nd highlight will act as 4th note placements. For number of rows, that will require some calculation that's kind of difficult to explain, but if you need it I'll try my best to provide an answer.

3. There is no difference at all. A 900 BPM FTM can be recreated in FamiTracker at normal speed (To some extent. The problem comes when you run out of instrument space.) without a problem and vice versa.

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Posted: 2014-10-12 04:59 Reply | Quote
Stratelier



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#62705
[quote=VinylScratch]2. For tempo: Set your 1st row highlight to whatever speed you're trying to achieve (keep the actual speed at 1, though).[/quote]
Actually, if you set your song speed and FT's 1st highlight such that they multiply to 24, then the 'logical BPM' (as shown in the status bar) will exactly match your stated song tempo (as long as you're not overclocking your raw engine speed; e.g. speed and tempo can't exceed 900BPM). E.g. when using the default song speed of 6, you have 4 rows per beat (6*4=24); if you're using a song speed 3, the song proceeds twice as fast so it takes 8 rows to make the same 'beat' (3*8=24).

But do set your second highlight to 4x (or whatever beats-per-measure your song usews) the value of your 1st highlight.

[quote=]3. There is no difference at all. A 900 BPM FTM can be recreated in FamiTracker at normal speed (To some extent. The problem comes when you run out of instrument space.) without a problem and vice versa.[/quote]

You can totally create instruments at 900BPM the same way you would do for any other tempo song - instrument volume envelopes/etc. are defined per raw (900BPM) engine cycles, the only difference is that at 900BPM every row represents exactly one engine cycle.

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Posted: 2014-10-12 06:22 Reply | Quote
OneHitLeft

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#62706
This is some extremely helpful stuff. Thanks everyone.

Posted: 2014-10-12 08:23 Reply | Quote
PaulMannIV

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#62707
Creative freedom, as I call it. I have been absorbed by the 900 BPM and haven't left it ever since. Everything I've worked on since my recreation of the Suicune Battle Theme has been in that tempo and that form. I personally love it, but that's just me. It's like a nearly lost art-form that few keep up anymore (I can think of me, SRES, and psn just off the top of my head).

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Posted: 2014-10-12 08:57  (Last Edited: 2014-10-12 08:58) Reply | Quote
jrlepage
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#62708
Everyone else has pretty much covered everything that needs to be said about full-speed tracking, so I'll just be a pedant and say that strictly speaking, nothing you'll ever write will be 900 bpm music.

Oh and the same module tracked in a standard, conventional way will be produce a smaller NSF than a full-speed mode module, due to the latter not having instruments to reduce redundant data.

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Posted: 2014-10-12 20:16 Reply | Quote
Stratelier



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#62713
[quote=jrlepage]Everyone else has pretty much covered everything that needs to be said about full-speed tracking, so I'll just be a pedant and say that strictly speaking, nothing you'll ever write will be 900 bpm music.[/quote]
That is very true; 900BPM is just the maximum [i]resolution[/i] you can divide an individual beat into.

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Posted: 2014-10-18 16:23  (Last Edited: 2014-10-18 16:36) Reply | Quote
VinylScratch

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#62852
[quote=VinylScratch]3. There is no difference at all. A 900 BPM FTM can be recreated in FamiTracker at normal speed (To some extent. The problem comes when you run out of instrument space.) without a problem and vice versa.[/quote]Now that I think about it, there are a few more things you can't create at normal speed that you could at 900 BPM. It's mostly expansion sound related, but I didn't have that on my mind when I wrote my previous post.

You could try abusing the Gxx command, but if you plan on going to such measures, you will only end up wasting your time.

Here's a list of what you can't create:
2A03: Hardware sweeps that happen every frame.
FDS: Waveform changes that happen every frame.
N163: Wave length & position changes that happen every frame.
VRC7: Volume, note, pitch and patch changes, all that happen every frame.

If you're reading this and you find that I missed something, leave a reply containing what I missed.

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Posted: 2014-10-18 20:51 Reply | Quote
jrlepage
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#62868
Gxx is absolutely useless in full-speed mode, unless you use refresh rates faster than 60Hz.

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Posted: 2014-10-18 21:18  (Last Edited: 2014-10-18 21:19) Reply | Quote
Stratelier



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#62870
[quote=jrlepage]Gxx is absolutely useless in full-speed mode, unless you use refresh rates faster than 60Hz.[/quote]
It's useless anyway because it counts by raw engine cycles, regardless of what engine speed you're using. If you're using a PAL engine then fullspeed is 750bpm rather than 900, but a G01 is one engine cycle all the same.

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Posted: 2014-10-18 22:57 Reply | Quote
jrlepage
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#62877
My point exactly.

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