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FamiTracker > General > Show Off Your Work > missing fundamental experiment Owner: gyms New post
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Posted: 2011-04-30 00:17  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:28) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#16536


Posted: 2011-04-30 03:16 Reply | Quote
fluidvolt

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#16549
Interesting experiment gyms. It's working for me on speakers.

If you're interested in the neuroscience of music you might want to check out the book [i]This Is Your Brain On Music[/i], it's a good read that discusses how the brain processes tones, timbres, and a lot more.

Posted: 2011-04-30 03:23 Reply | Quote
Archj



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#16551
I don't get it

Posted: 2011-04-30 03:37 Reply | Quote
fluidvolt

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#16553
[quote=Archj]I don't get it[/quote]

It has to do with the way we perceive sound; Each single tone we hear on the vast majority of instruments is comprised by many tones, the lowest tone is the fundamental. It's an established fact that if we hear the overtones associated with a specific fundamental, we'll still hear the fundamental even if it's missing due to the way the brain is wired to interpret sound.

That's off the top of my head so it might not all be perfectly right, check this out for further reading: [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_series_%28music%29]Harmonic series

Posted: 2011-04-30 03:46  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:29) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#16554


Posted: 2011-04-30 04:18 Reply | Quote
rainwarrior

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#16556
Interesting experiment.

Posted: 2011-04-30 05:47 Reply | Quote
Rushjet1
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#16564
it works with just sq1 and sq2 in his file too

Posted: 2011-04-30 07:08  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:29) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#16571


Posted: 2011-04-30 07:14  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:29) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#16572


Posted: 2011-04-30 22:00 Reply | Quote
TechEmporium

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#16612
This also has something to do with the way sound waves build up or subtract from each other. If you have two waves of the same phase/frequency & different amplitudes, they add up (& they'd also subtract if the phases/frequencies are different). Eventually, with sound, you can get increased/decreased volume due to the amplitude build-up, but you can also get different tones due to the resultant wave's phase shift.

In other words, with the correct overtones being used with the correct combination of notes, you're essentially creating a resultant sound wave with its own unique characteristics that sound as though it were a totally different set of notes.

[quote=Archj]I don't get it[/quote]

It has a lot to do with physics & neuroscience; if you're interested, you can take up physics in your high school years & learn more about how waves propagate. But you'll also need to have a greater understanding on how the human ear & brain works with sound & light.

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Posted: 2011-04-30 23:32 Reply | Quote
rainwarrior

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#16617
Take this harmonic series...

C-2, C-3, G-3, C-4, E-4, G-4 (approximate pitch)
100, 200, 300, 400, 500, 600 (frequency, hz)

Now play just E-4 and G-4, producing 500 and 600hz.

On our ear/brain or under most conditions of nonlinear amplification, the combination of tones produces quieter [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combination_tone]combination tones, i.e. additional tones at their sum and difference.

E-4 + G-4 produces: 100, 500, 600, 1100.

In the example with just E-4 and G-4 you also hear the difference 100hz (C-2) and sum 1100hz (F#5).

If you use more tones from the same harmonic series, you start to get a buildup of difference tones at the fundamental frequency, increasing its perceived strength.

Posted: 2011-05-01 01:31  (Last Edited: 2011-05-01 01:32) Reply | Quote
TechEmporium

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#16630
And if you can get the phase, frequency & amplitude just right, you can even cause a beat to occur...

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beat_(acoustics)]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beat_(acoustics)

The overall effect would be a reverb, similar to organ music in jazz.

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Posted: 2011-05-01 21:48  (Last Edited: 2011-05-01 21:48) Reply | Quote
Xyz_39808

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#16663
Be very careful using the Pxx, it's more along the lines of a change in hertz rather than a change in percentage...but in reverse for some reason. Probably a logarithmic sorta scale.

So, you'd expect that a C-6 P78 isn't as detuned as a C-2 P78 would be, but in practice, the higher note is more detuned.

Here, with P56, a C-2 gets detuned all the to a B-1. But the C-5, goes way the hell down to an F#-4.

In hz, 65.41 hz with P56 goes to 61.74 hz.
And 523.25 hz goes to 369.99 hz.

You should probably double check exported solo channels with tones made in audacity to check the out of tune harmonics.


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Posted: 2011-05-01 22:59  (Last Edited: 2011-05-01 23:03) Reply | Quote
TechEmporium

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#16667
Now, this is an indication of the hardware's physical limits; it's a well known fact that there's no such thing as the perfect semiconductor, as all semiconductor chips have impurities & imperfections.

If the 2A03 & other expansion chips were perfect, the higher notes wouldn't be as detuned as the lower ones when a pitch bend occurs (just like analog audio in nature). But semiconductors have maximum & minimum tolerance limits (& this is aside operating temperature limits) that affect how electricity flows through them; the result is increased detuning on higher notes as the semiconductor reaches saturation.

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Posted: 2011-05-01 23:02  (Last Edited: 2012-10-25 07:29) Reply | Quote
gyms



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#16669


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