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FamiTracker > General > Bug Reports & Feature Requests > Request list Owner: Dafydd New Post(Locked)
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Posted: 2010-04-21 04:00 Reply(Locked)
KuroBit

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#5796
TechEmporium wrote:
I hope you understand why MIDI & MOD importing's very difficult.

MIDI has simplistic audio, but it can have multiple channels (even more than the current & beta releases of FamiTracker can support). If the MIDI file has more sound channels than what you need, it will glitch out. That said, most MIDI files have more channels than FamiTracker can support because many MIDI composers don't take enough care to remove unused sound channels.

MOD is also difficult because MOD files can not only contain more sound channels than FamiTracker can support, but each instrument you create in a MOD tracker requires its own audio sample to be imported. In other words, MOD formatted music is like a FamiTracker project where every sound channel is a DPCM channel.


No no, I was meaning Midi exporting not Midi importing.

I'll be honest though, I don't understand the exact structure of Midi files and how you write to them (Otherwise I would've made my own music maker by now). But I have composed quite a few midi covers years ago so I know what it's capable of. (Pitch bending seems to be a little weird sometimes though... Some computers handle it differently than others...)

Posted: 2010-04-21 09:47  (Last Edited: 2010-04-21 09:48) Reply(Locked)
Shiru



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#5799
MIDI is industry standart, and thus it is much less limited than the trackers. The MIDI files are nothing like trackers, they are simply recorded stream of the events (like note on, off, program change, etc). The problem with MIDI importing is not number of the channels, but lack of similar structure (no patterns, no order list), and much higher time resolution than the trackers capable of (no rows at all, at least 1/250s quantize).

Regarding MIDI export, it is doable, though I personally see not much point in this. Need to make MIDI? Use proper tools. You never can get nice export anyway, and will have to edit it using MIDI editors (you will have to reassign instruments and redo all the drums, at least).

Posted: 2010-04-21 10:39 Reply(Locked)
Dave
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#5800
"TechEmporium" wrote:
MIDI has simplistic audio, but it can have multiple channels (even more than the current & beta releases of FamiTracker can support). If the MIDI file has more sound channels than what you need, it will glitch out. That said, most MIDI files have more channels than FamiTracker can support because many MIDI composers don't take enough care to remove unused sound channels.


wow. please don't reply if you don't know what you're talking about.

MIDI has as simplistic or as complex audio as the units it communicates with. it's not really even an audio format per se, just instructions sent to a device that produces audio. as for why famitracker will never support MIDI import well, it's nothing to do with MIDI creators being lazy and not removing superfluous sound channels. even with three midi channels in use, since they can be polyphonic it's likely there'd be more notes than famitracker could successfully import anyway. midis probably have an average of about 7 or 8 layers/tracks. it's just an entirely different format that works in a totally different way.

as for all MOD formatted music having channels like the DPCM channel.. yeah, just don't talk about things you don't understand, period.

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Posted: 2010-04-21 11:53 Reply(Locked)
KuroBit

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#5801
Er, I guess I was tired yesterday. I have no idea why I sugested mod exporting...

But as for Midis, that's how I was guessing they where set up, I just don't know about the exporting process from a programing point of view. I hope it's not too difficult...

Posted: 2010-04-21 14:19 Reply(Locked)
ElHuesudoII

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#5803
Actually, I don't see why MOD or XM exporting is not doable, the only problem I could imagine would be the effects...

Posted: 2010-04-21 16:25  (Last Edited: 2010-04-21 16:27) Reply(Locked)
Dafydd

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#5804
I don't really see what the beef with MIDI import is. Just have the import function say "error" if the MIDI uses channels other than 1-4, or if it has more than one note playing simultaneously in any channel at any time. If you limit the MIDI import to just notes, and you're very strict about what MIDI data the file can contain (as described above), it should be very possible to make a fully working MIDI import function without too much effort, even if there are other features I would like jsr to prioritize.

That said, I'd appreciate if people would try to resist from posting anything but actual requests in this thread. If you request something and someone else tells you it's a pointless request (or whatever), start a new thread for the request where you can discuss the reasons why or why not to make the request.

Posted: 2010-04-21 21:23 Reply(Locked)
retrotails

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#5807
Dafydd wrote:
I don't really see what the beef with MIDI import is. Just have the import function say "error" if the MIDI uses channels other than 1-4, or if it has more than one note playing simultaneously in any channel at any time. If you limit the MIDI import to just notes, and you're very strict about what MIDI data the file can contain (as described above), it should be very possible to make a fully working MIDI import function without too much effort, even if there are other features I would like jsr to prioritize.

That said, I'd appreciate if people would try to resist from posting anything but actual requests in this thread. If you request something and someone else tells you it's a pointless request (or whatever), start a new thread for the request where you can discuss the reasons why or why not to make the request.

I'd use MODplug to track songs because I'm more used to it, then follow the limitations of the MIDI import. Also, NSF importing would be awesome.

Posted: 2010-04-21 21:39 Reply(Locked)
Shiru



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#5808
Should I start new thread to explain why NSF importing is impossible?

Posted: 2010-04-21 22:43 Reply(Locked)
retrotails

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#5809
Shiru wrote:
Should I start new thread to explain why NSF importing is impossible?

It is possible. From NSF to MIDI to FamiTracker, anyways. If the MIDI importer was better, it'd work fine.

Posted: 2010-04-21 22:55 Reply(Locked)
Dafydd

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#5811
I suppose I could add another list to the first post where we put things that are pointless to request.

Posted: 2010-04-21 22:56 Reply(Locked)
Shiru



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#5812
NSF to MIDI is nothing like importing, it is guesswork based on stream of the 2A03 register writes produced by the original player.

Posted: 2010-04-22 00:10  (Last Edited: 2010-04-22 00:16) Reply(Locked)
KuroBit

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#5813
Wait wait, I sugested Midi exporting... How did we start talking about Midi importing?...

I didn't think that request was strange... (Although I agree that it should be a minor reqest)

EDIT: Oh, and you should probably remove "Unlimited Mode" from the list since he said he's not going to make it.

(Sorry for any spelling mistakes, I'm writing this all from a PSP...)

Posted: 2010-04-22 02:53 Reply(Locked)
TechEmporium

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#5819
Dave wrote:
... MIDI has as simplistic or as complex audio as the units it communicates with. it's not really even an audio format per se, just instructions sent to a device that produces audio. as for why famitracker will never support MIDI import well, it's nothing to do with MIDI creators being lazy and not removing superfluous sound channels...


Thanks for correcting me on the MIDI portion of the problem. As for the MOD part, I just looked into it further & realized that it's nothing like what I've said (MODs come with their own audio samples for each instrument).

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Posted: 2010-04-22 17:27 Reply(Locked)
ElHuesudoII

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#5829
Wow, people got into heated MIDI discussion mode and forgot the MOD/XM export issue.

So I ask again:

How possible would exporting to MOD/XM/IT/(other module track format(s)) be?

Posted: 2010-04-22 17:36 Reply(Locked)
Shiru



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#5830
Only notes, and not for MOD. Effects are major headache, because FamiTracker has much advanced system compared to MOD/XM.

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